Tribulation Gospel?
 
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Tribulation Gospel?

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(@watching47)
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Thanks Tammie,  God has used you to be such a wonderful blessing to all of us here.

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(@watching47)
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Thanks Arthur for the telling me about this Peter Ruckman.  According to this article I read he teaches that one minute after the rapture those remaining who become believers will have the impossible task of keeping the ten commandments to be saved...wrongly dividing the word of God.  I think I read about him before.

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Arthur
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He passed away in 2016 but sadly his bad theology is still being desiminated through his disciples. There are a lot of popular prophecy orientated you tubers who do this. 🙁

I can handle a difference of opinions in non-salvation issues. (ie timing of the Rapture) However, anyone who mixes in works with faith in order to be saved needs to be rightly rejected.

Lest anyone thinks I am overreacting, here are some quotes from Peter Ruckman, himself:

The original “plan of salvation” was pure WORKS (Gen. 2:16-17), and in the Millennium the last plan of salvation is again pure WORKS (Rev. 22:14), contrary to every immature, milksop, Baptist baby in your town or city. Genesis 3:22 corrects the kiddies. (Ruckman, Peter. Ruckman’s Bible References: Personal Notes on Salient Verses in the Bible, p. 7)

In the Old Testament, you find salvation before the Law by grace through faith and under the Law by faith and works… (Ruckman, Peter. Body, Soul, and Spirit. 1986, 1997, p. 12)

2. Start working your way to heaven.–
If the Lord comes and you remain behind, then start working like a madman to get to heaven, because you’re going to have to. You have entered a period of time called “The Great Tribulation,” and the plan of salvation in the Tribulation is faith in Jesus Christ plus your own good works. (Ruckman, Peter. Millions Disappear. 1989, p. 23)

Before the Rapture, you could have been saved by grace through faith plus nothing (Ephesians 2:8-9), but one minute after the Rapture took place you must get out the Ten Commandments and the Golden Rule and start learning them, because you’re going to be judged by them (Matthew 25:31-46). (Ruckman, Peter. Millions Disappear. 1989, p. 23)

It will take faith in Christ’s shed blood, plus works—exactly as in the OT it took faith in shed blood and works. (Ruckman, Peter. Millions Disappear. 1989, p. 26)

Needless to say, this is heretical.

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(@tenderreed)
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However the Tribulation plays out in all it's details and horror we won't be there to experience it!

Aside from teachings that fall outside the pale of orthodoxy, I am always angered by all the fine people that are always finding new and unique ways to explain how certain people will not be saved and left behind!

Sewing fear and unbelief while uniquely assailing once saved always saved!

Truth be known if that day is incalculable, teachings subscribing dates near or far all have the same odds of being wrong!  As we have seen!

Again this is why I have always leaned towards what the Spirit is speaking to the Church and seeking a divine disclosure as only God knows!

TR

 

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Speaking to a “divine disclosure” I again maintain that this is easily found and proven to be in the heart, character, nature of God as well as present in His previous dealings with man!

Short of any scripture specifically stating such it still very much a defensible position scripturally!

Given the office of prophet and the efficacy of prophecy as well as the ministering of the Holy Spirit, Christ himself was known to allude to to by statements such as “have I not told you” or “is it not written” as well as the promise given that that day will not overtake us unawares!

Indeed, the spirit of disclosure is found throughout the scriptures!

Therefore the idea of a divine disclosure ahead of time is a quite defensible position scripturally!

Just as has quickened the spirits of the prophets so too He may quicken the spirits of the Church prior to the Rapture!

I would rather prescribe to this notion than the teachings of men!

TR

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Again I am by no means claiming or teaching this a doctrinal truth but rather simply a possibility!

TR

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I hear ya TR.  I get tired of these preachers who package salvation messages into these slogans like the "ABC's of salvation" that actually involve works ,  the only part needed is the ""B" part "Believe". The "A" and "C" parts mean attaching works.  Romans 10:9, which is actually part of an appeal to Israel, is misused as a salvation slogan for individual salvation. It involves the work of confessing and does not involve the complete message of the gospel.

In 1975 I came to trust Christ as my Savior simply by reading and believing  Romans chapters 3 thru 5, which contains the complete message of salvation. Before then, I just heard "for all have sinned and all fall short of the glory of God" (Rom 3:23), but I didn't hear the next verse Rom 3:24. "being justified freely by his grace thru the redemption that is in Christ Jesus."

There are a number of teachers, good and bad, who have their fan base. One particularly popular is Andy Woods.  I have nothing against him, but it is a little scary how many people will just hang onto what he is saying.  I just hope people will be Bereans and search the scriptures and not be just spoon fed by these teachers and writers.

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Yohanan
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I get tired of these preachers who package salvation messages into these slogans like the “ABC’s of salvation” that actually involve works ,  the only part needed is the “”B” part “Believe”. The “A” and “C” parts mean attaching works. 

I have to whole heartedly disagree with this. "A" is for admitting you are a sinner. Unless you admit you are a sinner you see no need for a Savior. Calling that "works" is a bit over the top. "C" is for Confess. Matthew 10:32, straight from the Saviors mouth says Whoever therefor shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.  So if Jesus says we are to do this then I suppose He is the one we should be listening to. You may call this "works" but Jesus does not. We could really split hairs and call "Believing" works too because it is a verb, an action.

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Arthur
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I don't have a problem with the ABCs personally. We do need to admit we are sinners. That's repentance. (A change of mind of who we are and our need for salvation.) Repent and believe the Gospel. The Holy Spirit prompts us to do that so I don't see it as a work.

The confession comes after belief. I don't believe in Lordship Salvation which puts the cart before the horse. After we we have repented and believed the gospel then we confess Jesus as Lord.

That's the way I see it, anyhow.

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Yohanan, if you mean coming to realize you are an sinner in need a savior, that is admission which leads to faith in Christ for salvation.  And far as you citing from Matt 10:32, this was to the Jews still under the law and not to the church, the body of Christ in the age of grace.  It does not demand a public confession plus faith in the age of grace. The gospel given to Paul by the ascended Lord is for the church is the gospel of salvation for the church, (Gal 1:11,12).  I learned long ago to rightly divide what is for the Jews and for the church, the difference between law and grace.  We are simply called to accept by faith the gospel of our salvation, and in so accepting this we thus receive eternal salvation for ourselves.

 

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