Yea Greg, I am not saying it is both either. My point is I think Paul is simply referring to the departure of the HS and the church. I am surprised Andy Woods thinks that apostacy in this context is referring to departure. Here is my article on why I believe in the pre-Trib rapture: My favorite Pre-Trib Rapture verses: Luke 21:34-36 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man. Isaiah 26:20-21 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain. Revelation 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Zephaniah 2:3 Seek ye the Lord, all ye meek of the earth, which have wrought his judgment; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the Lord's anger. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 1 Corinthians 15:51-54 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. Just a question, on the lighter side churchgal. What was Lot's wife's name? :scratch: Ooh ooh … Jewish traditions have her name as Ado or Edith … But I gots a feeling her name was either Crystal, Rocky or Morton :yes: Rabbis refer to her as Idit. I think they forgot the “O”. ? I thought the same thing !!!! :mdrmdr: :mdrmdr: :mdrmdr: 2 Thess 2:1-8 tells us that the rapture will come before the 7 year tribulation. Paul tells us that all believers will be gone before the day of the Lord. The Holy Spirit will leave along with dead and living believers and then the antichrist the man of sin make his entrance. But we will be gone at the Day of Christ which is the Rapture, and sometime after that will begin the Day of Lord and the wrath ie, the 7 year tribulation that God will rescue us from beforehand. John Walvoord's book "Major Bible Prophecies" give more on all this in his chapter on the Rapture of the Church. Phil He is great! TR
