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Rapture was never immanent -until now? Signs Jesus commanded us to watch for

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chondra
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Signs Jesus commanded us to watch for have to be fulfilled first. Have they been? (yes, it’s all pre-trib)

* First sign we were told would start the clock ticking, Israel becoming a nation again, 1948, the fig tree parable.

Another generation shall not pass to see all the signs fulfilled. A generation according to Psalms is 70 to 80 yrs. Rapture could NOT happen BEFORE Israel turned 70.

* Wars & rumors of wars, earthquakes, insane weather, famine, pestilence, persecution of Christians, brother against brother, etc. The ‘birth pangs’, where all the above happen in greater frequency and intensity.

The above seems to have gone super mode 1-01-11 when the birds fell dead from the sky in Beebe Arkansas.

*Then we had the Arab spring where brother was fighting against brother.

*The Japan 9.0 EQ and tsunami (radiation from Fukushima nuclear reactors melting is still 24/7 spreading poison across the world air in Pacific Ocean).

Today, we see 5.0+ EQs weekly somewhere on the planet, record breaking floods; pestilence, droughts, sink holes, hurricane like storms on dry lands, tornadoes, giants & massive amounts of hail, snow in the dessert, volcanoes active at one time and freakish animal/mammal kills. When these are reported as ‘record breaking’, we don’t even notice anymore, it’s our new normal.

What other signs -Jesus commanded us to watch for- had to happen before the rapture?

* Christians being slaughtered, oppressed, silenced.

In 2011 when the Arab spring started, who were the main targets?

Christians and Christian historical/Biblical sites.

Today the persecution/murder of Christians in the ME is at an all-time high and has moved into the west. We’re seeing Christians being sued, silenced/censored/mocked, churches burned, vandalized. The western cultures are being destroyed & islamicized, by design.

Could the rapture have happened in 2014? Nope. There were still more ‘signs’ to be fulfilled. My opinion is; the four Blood moon tetrads (2014-2015) were telling us just that.

Enter in Candidate Trump announcing 2015, his run for US President.

Let’s see scripture signs first and tie in President Trump; always remembering, God is in charge of Kings/Presidents/Leaders over nations.

Scripture says (Luke 12:2): “Beware of the yeast of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy. For there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hid, that shall not be known. Therefore whatsoever ye have spoken in darkness shall be heard in the light; and that which ye have spoken in the ear in closets shall be proclaimed upon the housetop.

When Candidate Trump announced his run for presidency, the west went wild & after his election win and still in full force insanity.

The propaganda media exposed itself for the communist-Marxist machines they are; University, primary schools, Big Corp, Social Media (censoring-deplatforming), Hollywood (not really new), the money changers (banking-shutting off conserves/Christians businesses from making electronic transactions), DEMOCRATS (and RINOs) dropped their masks exposing the wicked-evil-vile people they really are.

Another sign we’re told would happen-division (Luke 12:52):

Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

The above, since President Trump was elected, has indeed divided houses; families, churches, social gathering, etc. NOT president Trump himself has done this, but the wicked ones who’ve exposed themselves- fighting him unjustly, tooth and nail.

Is there still another sign? Yup

Evil vs Good and so obvious one has to be blind not to see it.

(For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.)

2 Tim 3:2:

This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

The wicked are bringing in Satan’s kingdom…do they realize it?

* The apostate church, don’t need to go into this one; we’re all seeing it in every denomination.  Another sign that had to be fulfilled.

I’m not sure how much worse it’s going to get before Jesus returns, but we’ve met all the above signs.

Have I missed any signs Jesus said to watch for before he returns for his bride? :unsure:

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:amen:  Back in the 1980’s and 1990’s I kept hearing the rapture is imminent.  I don’t think the preachers knew how bad things would really get and that Israel is our timepiece to gauge where we are.   Now that we are seeing  it all converging and how ready Israel is for wanting their temple to be built and their enemies are parked at the borders ... its exciting to know the church is about to do a big disappearing act!

:flyup: :flyup: :flyup: :flyup: :flyup: :flyup: :flyup: :flyup:

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David W. Roche
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Some of the events posted are tribulation events, and not pre-rapture necessities.  I do agree that their present appearance tells us we must be really close.  But the only one I can really say is required is Israel being a nation and in control of Jerusalem.

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I often ponder this passage here ... if this is pertaining only to the tribulation saints or could it be for both the church right now as well?  After each blood moon I have literally seen time speeding up on my clocks and can’t get the things done in the day that I use to.  I’ve even asked others ... saved as well as the unsaved and they are saying the same thing - they feel the days and months are flying by quickly.  Could it be something supernaturally is happening behind the scenes?

 

Matt 24:22-24

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

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The doctrine of imminency for me is this:  God said it would happen so it is imminent.  However, the Resurrection/Rapture event is an "appointed time" and will take place on the Feast of Pentecost, on that day, as only known to God, probably in May or early June maybe in 2019 if God is using a 70-year countdown from 1949 to Daniel's 70th week.

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The Time of Job's Trouble:

A Type of Remnant Israel in Great Tribulation

Jesus[1] informs us that the last three and half years of Daniel's 70th week, a seven (7) year period, will be known as a time of "great tribulation" for the Jews.[2]  Daniel's 70th week is comprised of two divisions of three and a half years or 42 months each.  The second half commences in Daniel 9:27b, 11:31; Matthew 24:15, Daniel 12:7 and Revelation 12:6.

Job’s name means “One Persecuted”.  The Book of Job has 42 chapters, coincidentally matching the 42 months of Great Tribulation.[3]  Job is a “type” of faithful believing remnant Israel[4] during Daniel’s 70th week which will keep the commandments of God and have the faith and testimony of Jesus.[5]  Job, like Daniel's three friends in Nebuchadnezzar's furnace stoked seven times hot, remained faithful to God's promises during his tribulation.[6]

God will cause Israel to pass under the rod and bring a Jewish group, whom Isaiah calls "remnant"[7] Israel, into the "bond of the covenant".[8]  This covenant is the same bond of covenant which the Lord confirmed three times to the fathers of Israel: to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.[9]  This is the "confirmed covenant" of  Daniel 9:27a.  It is the covenant which had been suspended with the rejection and execution of Israel's Messiah.[10]  It is the covenant which Paul says was not annulled[11] by the law of Moses which Christ fulfilled[12] in totality and perfection.  The law being fulfilled by God in Christ did not annul God's promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.  These promises were deferred and will yet be subject reinstatement following the fullness of the Gentiles.[13]  The remnant Jew, as obedient Jacob, will be God's inheritance.[14]  The blessing to the Gentiles, which followed the Jewish nation's rejection of their Messiah, is presently a spiritual blessing which figuratively flows from Isaac, the child of promise, through Christ to all who would receive Him during this Age of Pentecost.  There is yet a coming opportunity for the seed of Jacob following the mystery of the resurrection/rapture.[15]

Romans 11 is the seminal chapter on the coming Jewish salvation during the Time of Jacob's Trouble. There is a blessing coming to the remnant of true Israel[16].  These will be the “seed of Jacob” who turn from the transgression.[17]  They will be “remnant Israel” as proclaimed by the apostle Paul and the prophet Isaiah.[18]  The believing and obedient remnant shall be saved.[19]  This salvation will occur during the season of the Second Advent of Messiah.[20]  This faithfulness, deliverance and salvation was pre-figured in Job.

The Lord “turned the captivity” of Job in Chapter 42 at the end of his time of his trouble.  Israel will go into captivity during Daniel's 70th week.[21]  The first occurrence of this phrase in the Bible "turned the captivity" appears in Job 42:10.  A survey of the forty-two chapters reveals that Job was never taken captive by anyone.  This is a curious phrase which demands further study and meditation.

This “turned the captivity” phrase is used numerous times in the Bible.  This phrase refers to the “restoration of Israel” at the Second Coming.[22]  The use of  this phrase “turned the captivity” of Job provides proof that God has linked the time of Job’s trouble to the time of Jacob’s trouble, a time which precedes the Second Coming of Christ.[23]

At the end of Job’s troubles, God gave him a double portion of what Satan had taken away.[24] Isaiah tells us that the Jew, the righteous seed of Jacob, will also be given double portion[25] following their restoration into the Millennial Kingdom, just as we see in Job, as a type of restored and saved remnant of Israel.

Job had ten children which died during his persecution by Satan.[26]  He had seven sons and three daughters restored to him at the end of his trouble.[27]  This is the same number that had died during his trouble.[28] It is very plausible that these sons and daughters were resurrected.  In the Book of Revelation, we have a group of Jews which will be resurrected.  These will be the seed of Jacob which will have been beheaded for their witness of Jesus, and for the word of God which will not have worshipped the beast, neither his image, nor will have received his mark.[29]  This resurrection will be the “third order” of the first resurrection, the resurrection of righteousness in Christ.[30]  This proposition is certainly a “type” of possibility as we make the case for Job and the restoration of remnant Israel.

We have another clue to consider as we postulate that Job is a type of Israel.  How old was Job when his troubles began?  The Scriptures do not give us Job's age.  Scripture does give us a mathematical word puzzle with clues.  Job was seventy (70) years of age.  We know this because God added 140 years to Job's life as a double portion.[31]  If Job were 70 years old, then 140 years would be a double portion.

This year, 2019, Israel will turn 70 years of age based on a count commencing in 1949.  This year stands out over 1948 because 1949 was the year  in which (1) Israel defeated its enemies in its war of independence and possession of the land, a type of second conquest of Canaan;  and (2) the world recognized Israel's sovereignty as a nation possessing the land.  Israel was admitted to the United Nations on May 11, 1949.[32]  I believe Joshua's conquest of Canaan provides a basis for this proposition.  God gave Israel a portion of the title deed to the land promised to Abraham, but the transfer of ownership required a war of possession.  War established Israel's sovereignty over the land.

I believe a 70-year countdown commenced in 1949, a countdown which may lead to the Time of Jacob's Trouble, Daniel's 70th week.  Now, in 2019, Israel has had ten (10) Sabbath cycles of seven (7) years in the land as a sovereign nation.  Israel is fully established as a mature nation.  The 70-year duration of this establishment is perfect for temple[33] construction and Daniel's 70th week.  Israel's future salvation will be as "life from the dead".[34]  Israel's salvation will represent divine forgiveness on the order of "seventy times seven"[35], a reference to Daniel's 70-Weeks prophecy when deliverance and salvation will come to remnant Israel.[36]

The "day of trouble" approaches.[37]  Some will trust in chariots, and some in horses: but [remnant Israel] will remember the LORD our God.[38]

Can we reasonably postulate that a 70-year old Israel is mature for God's judgment?  Will God commence the times of Daniel 9:27?  Is this 70-year period a sign for Israel?  The Jew requires a sign.[39]  Will the Rock of Israel[40], the Jew's stumbling stone, their rock of offense[41], Zion's foundation stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone[42], the rock of Meribah[43], finally become their Rock of Salvation[44]?

Is this 70 years the generational context of the "fig tree and all the trees" parable of Luke 21:29?[45]  We may say with certainty that Israel, as a nation, is the "fig tree".[46]  Certainly, then we can say that the United Nations represents "all the trees".  David served his generation 70 years.[47]  The offspring of the Son of David, Lord Jesus, has set an appointment to return.[48]

Surely, God is inviting our reliance on His patterns of prophecy as we search and study the Scriptures of truth.  We model the prophets of ancient days searching what manner of time that Christ, our hope of glory, should appear.[49]   He has given us a more sure word of prophecy.[50]

Come quickly Lord Jesus.

For additional essays see: https://www.amazon.com/Day-Thy-Visitation-Jacobs-Trouble/dp/1981076387

[1] All Bible citations are based on the King James Bible, Authorized Version
[2] Matthew 24:15-21; Revelation 11:2, 12:6,13:5
[3] Ibid
[4] Isaiah 10:20-22
[5] Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 20:4-5
[6] Daniel 3:25; Isaiah 48:10
[7] Isaiah 10:21; Note: Isaiah named his eldest son "Shear-jashub" which means a "remnant shall return". Isaiah 7:3
[8] Ezekiel 20:37
[9] Genesis 22:16; 1 Chronicles 15:15-18; Psalm 105:8-11
[10] Daniel 9:26a
[11] Galatians 3:14-15
[12] Matthew 5:17
[13] Romans 11:25; 1 Corinthians 15:52; 1 Thessalonians 4:17
[14] Deuteronomy 32:9
[15] 1 Corinthians 15:51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:17
[16] Romans 9:6
[17] Isaiah 59:20
[18] Romans 9:27; Isaiah 10:21-23; Micah 7:18-20; Zechariah 13:8-9; Jeremiah 33:24-26; Ezekiel 14:21-22; Psalm 37:39-40
[19] Romans 11:26-28
[20] Revelation 20:4-5
[21] Deuteronomy 30:3; Psalm 53:6
[22] Deuteronomy 30:3; Psalm 14:7, 53:6, 85:11, 126:1,4; Jeremiah 29:14, 33:7,11, 26; Lamentations 2:14; Zephaniah 2:7, 3:20;
[23] Jeremiah 30:7
[24] Job 42:10
[25] Isaiah 61:7
[26] Job 1:2
[27] Job 42:13
[28] Job 1:18-19
[29] Revelation 20:4-5
[30] 1 Corinthians 15:24; Revelation 20:6  Note: There are three orders to the first resurrection, Christ the first fruits, the Christ's own at His appearance, and then comes the end at Revelation 20:4.  See 1 Corinthians 15:20-28  It is likely that these three orders will follow the pattern of Israel's three pilgrimage feasts: Unleavened Bread, Pentecost and Tabernacles. See Exodus 34:22-23
[31] Job 42:10, 16
[32] Israel became the 59th member of the United Nations.
[33] The word "the temple" has a Hebrew gematria value of 70. See Zechariah 1:12-16 where the temple is built following a 70-year period.
[34] Romans 11:15; Isaiah 66:9
[35] Matthew 18:21-22; 1 Kings 8:61
[36] Romans  9:27,11:26; Joel 2:32
[37] Psalm 20:1 Note:  Psalm 20 which speaks to the Time of Jacob's Trouble is comprised of 70 Hebrew words.
[38] Psalm 20:7
[39] 1 Corinthians 1:22
[40] 2 Samuel 23:3
[41] 1 Peter 2:8
[42] Isaiah 28:16
[43] Exodus 17:6;Numbers 20:13
[44] Psalm 62:2
[45] Psalm 90:10
[46] Luke 13:6-9
[47] Acts 13:36; 2 Samuel 5:4; 1 Kings 2:11
[48] Revelation 22:16
[49] 1 Peter 1:11; Colossians 1:27
[50] 2 Peter 1:19; Ecclesiastes 1:18

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David W. Roche
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Geri wrote:

"Except those days should be shortened" means that the Father has already determined from before the creation of the world exactly how long the tribulation could go on without humanity being utterly wiped out.  God has not changed His mind; the Greek tense indicates that the days had already been limited in number previously.  Therefore, it is a verse for the Tribulation, meaning the second coming will take place on the last possible day before we kill ourselves off the planet.

It does often seem as if there just aren't enough hours in the day to do what we'd like to get done.  I think it's likely a consequence of aging that causes our perception of time to alter.  In addition, there is so much more "stuff" to fill our days and nights that squeezing it all in becomes impossible.  The  more time we have "freed up," the more we find competing for those hours and the less we actually get done.

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Do you feel in the tribulation when “the days are shorten” ... is it less hrs in the day - than 24 hrs per day?   And does the shortening start at the beginning of the tribulation or mid point?

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David W. Roche
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The expression just means that from the beginning God has predetermined that the number of days in the last half of the tribulation are limited to 1,260.  I don't see it as a reduction from what the Bible says, nor do I think the hours in a day will be shorter.  God has already shortened the time by not allowing anything more to come.

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Taureauchien
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Yes, I've always interpreted as ;If this went on any longer, no one would survive.

So God in His infinite knowledge knew how long it would take to do what needs to be done. Had it continued, nobody would be left to repopulate the earth during the millennial reign

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