Food for thought… Is the Second Coming in the Fall?

MAIN DISCUSSION FORUM Forums Speculation on Timing of Rapture or Tribulation Food for thought… Is the Second Coming in the Fall?

This topic contains 7 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by Heather R Heather R 5 months, 3 weeks ago.

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  • #125757
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    I don’t think so.

    The more I research, the more I do not believe the Second Coming will be in the fall. Here are some verses I use to get there…

    Matthew 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

    Most of us probably believe these words to be figurative and symbolic. I believe they are symbolic and very literal. The context of the chapter is giving signs which lead up to the second coming. From the text here, I would conjecture the season of the Lord’s second coming is being expressly given: summer. Just as a fig tree produces fruit in preparation for a summer harvest, so too will Israel be gathered back to her land in preparation for the final harvest.

    Most of you probably know there are three main harvest seasons used in the Bible regarding the end times: barley, wheat, and grapes. The grape harvest comes directly after the wheat harvest and is usually very shortly after Pentecost. The harvest most closely associated with the Fall Feasts is not actually the grape harvest. It’s the olive harvest. That isn’t directly in view in end times symbolism.

    We know Joel 3, Revelation 14, and Revelation 19 all have to do with Jesus treading the winepress of the fierceness of the wrath of God almighty when He returns. But there is actually a more direct link to the timing of that specific harvest…

    Micah 7:1 Woe is me! for I am as when they have gathered the summer fruits, as the grapegleanings of the vintage: there is no cluster to eat: my soul desired the firstripe fruit. 2 The good man is perished out of the earth: and there is none upright among men: they all lie in wait for blood; they hunt every man his brother with a net. 3 That they may do evil with both hands earnestly, the prince asketh, and the judge asketh for a reward; and the great man, he uttereth his mischievous desire: so they wrap it up. 4 The best of them is as a brier: the most upright is sharper than a thorn hedge: the day of thy watchmen and thy visitation cometh; now shall be their perplexity. 5 Trust ye not in a friend, put ye not confidence in a guide: keep the doors of thy mouth from her that lieth in thy bosom. 6 For the son dishonoureth the father, the daughter riseth up against her mother, the daughter in law against her mother in law; a man’s enemies are the men of his own house. 7 Therefore I will look unto the Lord; I will wait for the God of my salvation: my God will hear me. 8 Rejoice not against me, O mine enemy: when I fall, I shall arise; when I sit in darkness, the Lord shall be a light unto me. 9 I will bear the indignation of the Lord, because I have sinned against him, until he plead my cause, and execute judgment for me: he will bring me forth to the light, and I shall behold his righteousness.

    I like Amos 8 the best, though.

    Israel’s major seasons aren’t spring and fall. Those are the feast seasons, so we give them lots of attention. But Israel’s mains seasons are summer and winter. Both are mentioned in Matthew 24 – what I mentioned above about the fig tree and summer being nigh, and of course them being instructed to pray their flight not take place in the winter or on a Sabbath which is mid-trib.

    That summer and winter are the main seasons is also illustrated in Zechariah with the text which talks about living water flowing yearround.

    Zechariah 14:8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

    It’s been inferred by lots of people, myself included, that the Second Coming would happen around Tabernacles since we’re told all who are left of the nations will go up year to year to worship the King and to keep the feast of Tabernacles. But when they saw Zechariah 9’s prophecy about their King riding on the colt of a donkey being fulfilled, they tried to celebrate Tabernacles then. It’s also why they were crying out “Hosanna to the Son of David” and waving palm branches. Solomon did something similar, and he was also the Son of David. Tabernacles being celebrated immediately after the messiah arrives isn’t because it’s necessarily that time of the year. It’s because there is an inferred instruction to celebrate Tabernacles when the King comes… so that’s what they were trying to do on Palm Sunday. It’s also why Peter suggested the booths when he saw the prelude to a glorified Jesus talking with Moses and Elijah at the Transfiguration. It wasn’t Tabernacles. Rather, Peter thought the Transfiguration was signaling the Kingdom had come. And when the Kingdom comes, Tabernacles is celebrated.

    So I could be wrong, but I’m not feeling the fall any longer for the Second Coming. I just don’t think there is much to support it except for those ideas which stem from beliefs about the Fall Feasts and how they’ll be fulfilled. I have gone over how I believe they’ve all been fulfilled already. Just my .02.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #125760

    2ndcoming
    Participant

    My belief is Jesus shall return in spring. Here are the reasons.

    1/ It is very likely that the marriage supper of the Lamb is the unfinished Passover,and Jesus shall finish this Passover seder with the marriage supper being held on a future Passover,with Jesus returning on Nisan 15. Even Revelation 19:13 supports this idea.

    Revelation 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

    The only time Jesus’ cloth was dipped in blood was on the Passover when he was crucified. He is coming back with cloth dipped in blood. It suggests that he is coming back on a future Passover.

    2/ Luke 13:35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

    “Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord” is the Hallel,which forms part of Psalm 113-118. They often sing and recite this Hallel during Passover. Jesus says that they will not see him again until they say/recite this Hallel. It suggests that Jesus is coming back on a future Passover.

    3/ Hosea 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

    Notice the sequence of the rain,with latter rain (spring rain) placing before the former rain (Autumn rain). “He shall come unto us as the rain”,it suggests that Jesus is coming back in the season of spring.

    4/ Daniel 2:35 Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.

    The stone is Jesus. When he comes back,he shall smite kingdoms,and they shall become the chaff of the summer threshingfloors. Because it will take some times to judge the ten toes and the statue,it shall put Jesus’ return in season of spring.

    There could be few more scriptures to suggest second coming on a future Passover. Isaiah 11:11 is a good one.

    Isaiah 11:11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.

    The “first time”,implied by the second time,was obviously that of Exodus,which took place on the previous Passover. The second time God saves His people may very well take place on a Passover again.

    #125761

    2ndcoming
    Participant

    It is also my belief that the Day of the Lord and the Great Day of the Lord may refer to a specific Passover during which Jesus shall return with us from heaven. It is called Day of the Lord because of his sacrifice for us on that day. That day is very specific for Him ,and He owns that day. This is why God refers to that Day as the Day of the Lord.

    http://biblehub.net/search.php?q=day+of+the+Lord

    #125774

    2ndcoming
    Participant

    Few more scriptures that support Jesus is coming back on a Passover.

    1/

    Micah 7:14 Feed thy people with thy rod, the flock of thine heritage, which dwell solitarily in the wood, in the midst of Carmel: let them feed in Bashan and Gilead, as in the days of old.

    15 According to the days of thy coming out of the land of Egypt will I shew unto him marvellous things.

    16 The nations shall see and be confounded at all their might: they shall lay their hand upon their mouth, their ears shall be deaf.

    17 They shall lick the dust like a serpent, they shall move out of their holes like worms of the earth: they shall be afraid of the LORD our God, and shall fear because of thee.

    God shall show Israel marvellous things according to the days of their coming out of Egypt. When God compares His second coming to the times in Exodus,it also ambiguously implies that Jesus shall return on Passover,to rescue his people according to the days in Exodus.

    2/

    Zechariah 8:18 And the word of the LORD of hosts came unto me, saying, 19 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; The fast of the fourth month, and the fast of the fifth, and the fast of the seventh, and the fast of the tenth, shall be to the house of Judah joy and gladness, and cheerful feasts; therefore love the truth and peace.

    When God comes back,he shall turn all their fast into joy and gladness. Notice the sequence of their fast. It begins with the fast of the fourth month. Then the fifth,the seventh and finally the tenth. It shall put Jesus’ second coming in spring.

    If Jesus returns during their fall feast,then the sequence of turning their fast into joy should begin with the seventh,then the fasts of the tenth,then the fourth,ending with the fifth. But this is not the case here.

    3/

    Haggai My Feast

    Zechariah Yahweh has remembered

    Malachi Messenger

    Put them together,we have the following,

    “My Feast!” Yahweh has remembered. A messenger He shall send.

    To remember “my feast”, that feast has to be significant,and an important event has taken place on that feast in history. The Passover in 32 AD is the most significant event in history other than God dwelt in flesh. Having said this,the feast that Yahweh shall remember is the Passover feast,not feast of trumpet because there is no significant event happen on that feast in history.

    Even the lining up of the twelve minor prophets hide the secrecy and the clue concerning when shall Jesus return.

    #125776

    John
    Participant

    Matthew 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

    Most of us probably believe these words to be figurative and symbolic. I believe they are symbolic and very literal. The context of the chapter is giving signs which lead up to the second coming. From the text here, I would conjecture the season of the Lord’s second coming is being expressly given: summer. Just as a fig tree produces fruit in preparation for a summer harvest, so too will Israel be gathered back to her land in preparation for the final harvest.

    Wel, according to wikipedia the fig trees have two crops of figs each year:

    “Two crops of figs are potentially produced each year. The first or breba crop develops in the spring on last year’s shoot growth. In contrast, the main fig crop develops on the current year’s shoot growth and ripens in the late summer or fall. The main crop is generally superior in both quantity and quality to the breba crop. However, some cultivars produce good breba crops (e.g., ‘Black Mission’, ‘Croisic’, and ‘Ventura’).”

    #125782
    Savedat33
    Savedat33
    Participant

    The Rapture in the Song of Songs
    By: M.J Agee

    Secret of the Stairs

    One of my favorite scriptures is Song of Solomon 2:10-14. It paints a beautiful picture of the Rapture of the Church when flowers are unfurling their blooms like tiny upside-down umbrellas and birds are singing for the sheer joy of being alive in the spring.

    The Lord teaches by types and likenesses. Solomon was a son of David, a good type of Christ, the Son of David. In this scripture, Christ is the beloved Son who comes “leaping upon the mountains, skipping upon the hills.” He addresses his loving bride, the Bride of Christ, those of the Church that have a love relationship with him and are to be taken to Heaven when the Rapture takes place. As this passage begins, we hear her saying,

    The voice of my beloved! behold, he cometh leaping upon the mountains, skipping upon the hills…My beloved spake, and said unto me, Rise up, my love, my fair one, and come away. For, lo, the winter is past, the rain is over and gone; The flowers appear on the earth; the time of the singing of birds is come, and the voice of the turtle (literally, turtledove) is heard in our land; The fig tree putteth forth her green figs, and the vines with the tender grape give a good smell. Arise, my love, my fair one, and come away. O my dove, that art in the clefts of the rock, in the secret places of the stairs.
    The word “places” is not in the original. This is why it is in italics in the King James Version. The word was supplied by the translators, who did not understand the full significance of the passage. This scripture is talking about the secret of the stairs.

    “Rise Up” “Come Up Hither”

    “Rise up,” it says, similar to the “Come up hither” of Revelation 4:1. Both are referring to the Rapture, when we will meet Christ in the air. These stairs remind us of Jacob’s ladder. He “dreamed, and behold a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to Heaven: and behold the angels of God ascending and descending on it. And, behold the LORD stood above it” (Genesis 28:12).

    In the Song of Solomon, if you have an ear to hear, you will be able to hear the overtones if you listen carefully. The Lord is the bridegroom. “Rise up,” he says, “my love, my fair one, (his Bride is his love) and come away (it is the Rapture). For, lo, the winter is past (it is spring), the rain is over and gone;” (the latter rain of Nisan, our March 28 through April 26, is over).

    Former and Latter Rain

    The former and latter rains are such definite seasons in Israel that they are listed on their calendars that list the feasts and times of harvest. The former rain starts Tishri 1, in the fall, the latter rain on Nisan 1 in the spring. This is of tremendous import for according to Hosea 5:3, the Lord “shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth,” but more about that later.

    April Showers Bring May Flowers

    At the time of the Rapture, “The flowers appear on the Earth (i.e., April showers bring May flowers, so it is May, and May 31, 1998 is the only time Pentecost falls on Sunday before the 40 years of probation end); the time of the singing of birds is come (it is spring, when we will sing ‘a new song’ as we fly like birds up to heaven), and the voice of the turtle (tor, turtledove, a migratory bird that returns suddenly in the spring and is a symbol of the Spirit of God) is heard in our land; The fig tree (Israel) putteth forth her green figs (the fruit of Israel is not quite ripe when the Rapture takes place), and the vines with the tender grape give a good smell (it is the time of the firstripe grapes, i.e., Siven on the Jewish calendar)

    In the Clefts of the Rock

    “Arise, my love, my fair one and come away (the Rapture). O my dove (one sealed with the Spirit of God until the day of Redemption), that art in the clefts of the rock (i.e., in Christ, for ‘that Rock was Christ’), in the secret of the stairs.” If we truly believe in Christ and trust him as our Saviour, we are “in Christ.” We are in the clefts of the Rock. When he is ready to take the Body of Christ to Heaven, all those joined firmly to him will go.

    The Open Door

    Do you agree that the Rapture is actually the secret of the stairs. Like Jacob’s ladder, the top of the stairs reaches to heaven, angels ascend and descend on it and the Lord stands above it. The Rapture is when we will go through a great door in heaven to stand before our Lord Jesus Christ. Revelation 4:1 says,

    behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. And immediately I was in the spirit: and behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
    Date Clues

    Just look at the exciting date clues our loving God has given us. It is not dreary winter, but beautiful spring, and after the latter rain, every sprig is coming to life with lush foliage. Spring is appropriate for the Rapture is also a time of resurrection. The green figs enable us to place the Rapture between the end of the latter rain (April 26) and when the early figs ripen, in some years the end of May, in others early June. Pentecost is Sivan 6 (May 31 in 1998) after the rains are over and there are birds, green figs and May flowers.

    The Lord’s timing is perfect. A beautiful spring day makes us want to fly when we hear the voice of the turtledove, ie., the Lord, for the Lord himself shall descend with a shout.

    Time of the Firstripe Grapes

    As you study Scripture, you will find other parallels. For instance, after leaving Egypt on the Passover in the first month, when Moses sent them to spy out the promised land, it was the “time of the firstripe grapes. So they went up” (shadow of the Rapture), “and searched the land.” The Septuagint says it was “the days of spring, the forerunners of the grape.” In Israel, grapes begin to ripen in Sivan, so it looks like we will go up to search our promised land in the Jewish month of Sivan.

    :rose:

    http://prophecycorner.theforeverfamily.com/song.html

    Just some more food for thought. :rose:

    *fair use for informational purposes*

    #125784
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    In contrast, the main fig crop develops on the current year’s shoot growth and ripens in the late summer or fall.

    Yep 🙂 I’m guessing it’s the main fig in view in Matthew 24. I think it’s both an indication of the time of year, as well as the lateness of the prophetic hour. There are two harvests the end of days is likened to… the treading of the winepress, which is the first of the summer fruit harvest and begins shortly after Pentecost… and the separation of the wheat and tares, which also happens after the firstfruits offering of the grain on Pentecost. I’m of the opinion both point to the summer. And I guess I’d have to question why Jesus told the Jews to watch for they know not what hour their Lord doth come (Matthew 24 & 25) if He was actually going to arrive when they thought He would, which is in conjunction with one of the Fall Feasts. Seems like a warning wouldn’t be necessary if that was the case.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #125785
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    The stone is Jesus. When he comes back,he shall smite kingdoms,and they shall become the chaff of the summer threshingfloors. Because it will take some times to judge the ten toes and the statue,it shall put Jesus’ return in season of spring.

    Sorry, but no. All judgment will be completed in one day. That’s the bulk of what I’m working on proving in my paper at the moment. The Day of the Lord is a very literal period of just that… one day.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
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