Jesus' Second Advent Sign in 2024 Shouldn't Be Dismissed!

MAIN DISCUSSION FORUM Forums Speculation on Timing of Rapture or Tribulation Jesus' Second Advent Sign in 2024 Shouldn't Be Dismissed!

This topic contains 30 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by  Terry 2 weeks, 3 days ago.

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  • #129892

    Terry
    Participant

    I think we should all be rejoicing :yahoo: that a sign has finally been discovered which could be the sign of the Son of man in heaven, possibly indicating the very year Jesus will be returning to this earth, in 2024.
    And if Jesus will be returning to this earth in 2024, that means the Rapture will occur seven years earlier, in 2017.

    If this sign is not the sign of the Son of man in heaven (the sign of Jesus’ Second Advent), then I don’t know what is! For there are no other signs in any other years after 2024 which can be the sign of the Son of man in heaven, at least that I’m aware of.

    If anyone knows any other years after 2024 which could be the sign of the Son of man in heaven, please let me know, and the reason or reasons why you think it’s in a particular year.
    And if nobody knows, :unsure: then perhaps the Second Advent sign in 2024 IS the sign of the Son of man in heaven, after all! Of Jesus returning to this earth in 2024.

    #129894

    Watchman35
    Participant

    Hi Terry. What sign specifically are you referring to for 2024?

    John 14:1-3 “Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also."

    #129895
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    I really, really, really, really don’t want to burst anyone’s bubbles, but the sign of the coming of the Son of man is detailed within text of Matthew 24.

    Matthew 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

    It’s then later referred to again by virtually the same description.

    Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

    The glory of the Lord will light up the night sky, like lightning. The description given about seeing from east to west regards all eyes seeing Him coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

    I don’t know if there is some other sign, but based on the fact all the celestial lights will be turned out, no one would see it anyway.

    -Sun darkened
    -Moon not give light
    -Stars withdraw their shining

    I’m sorry, but no one is going to see a sign in the heavens at Jesus’s Second Coming. All anyone, and everyone, will see is Jesus, Himself.

    Joel 2:1 The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:

    Joel 3:15 The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

    I know everyone really wants a sign to tell us how close we are. Perhaps that was why Hebrews 10:25 told us to encourage each other, and so much the more, as we see “the day” approaching. We’re almost there. Don’t give up! :rose:

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #129898

    Terry
    Participant

    Hi Terry. What sign specifically are you referring to for 2024?[/quoteFear-JustFaith

    The sign of the planet Jupiter entering the constellation Taurus from the direction of Aries, passing over the boundary between the Pleiades and the first star of Taurus, and then later, between the horns of Taurus, and then while being in conjunction with Mars, the war planet.
    This sign beginning on May 14th 2024. In this later part of this sign it is said that Armageddon is at hand and Jesus has come to war against the armies arrayed against Him. Taurus being a charging bull.

    This information is in the post by NoFear-JustFaith posted on RitaNow on February 23rd 2017, It’s entitled: “SIGNS IN THE HEAVENS: SECOND ADVENT”. If you search this site you may be able to find it. I wish it could somehow be posted again so you could see it, and read it.

    #129902
    Dano
    Dano
    Participant

    I’m not saying one way or another regarding all of the happenings that can certainly very much appear as signs, however – regardless of anyone’s personal interpretation or belief, there are certainly some very interesting “happenings” between now and 2024. Some could justifiably argue that they are exceptionally coincidental, and maybe could be viewed certainly as seasons and that we should not be surprised.
    The difficulty lies within the English translation of the Bible, so we need to be careful of the possibility that wordings and phrases in the English language could be not entirely accurate to the original language and context in which the Bible was written. However –
    The Sept 23rd Virgo birthing Jupiter thing is interesting especially when viewed within the optics of Revelation 12.
    Coincidentally there is a total solar eclipse in August (21st or 23rd I believe) that will present coast to coast darkness as its a total solar eclipse. And – Coincidentally to Terry’s post – an almost exact total solar eclipse will occur 7yrs later in October (15th I believe) 2024.
    These total solar eclipses do occur in very close proximity to the astronomical events that could be interpreted as described in Rev 12 and 15 and the combination of the eclipses and nightfall on the other side of the world could very much effectively combine to cast the world in total darkness.
    I’m not saying what anyone should believe or interpret, but they are certainly coincidental planetary events that could be linked to coincidental scripture and seemingly might produce some very coincidental results. And we do know factually that biblical era Jewish people were extremely astronomically focused and consistent paired and interpreted events with solar, lunar and planetary happenings.
    Clearly these “things” combined with everything else going on in the world today should undoubtedly indicate to us to at the very least recognize the seasons in which we live. Not much longer everyone. God bless!
    Dan

    #129903

    Terry
    Participant

    And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

    Thank you, Heather, for sharing that, 🙂 makes perfect sense what you said, :yes: and I hadn’t considered all of this. Very helpful information. But what I’m wondering is perhaps before the sun is darkened, and the moon does not give it’s light, and before the stars withdraw their shining this sign is seen. Maybe this is a possibility.

    I don’t know if there is some other sign, but based on the fact all the celestial lights will be turned out, no one would see it anyway.

    Perhaps the sign I just explained to Watchman35 may be another sign.

    I am so glad we can discuss these things, and come to a better understanding.

    #129904
    Dano
    Dano
    Participant

    Addition to my previous post. Total darkness due to a combination of a total eclipse and nightfall would certainly be a very opportune time for a flash like lightning from the east to west to be seen, and then the emergence of the sun revealing clouds and possibly our savior riding on them could conceivably be a very plausible scenario. And think of the awesome dramatic effect of the sun emerging revealing Jesus on the clouds. I mean – wow!
    But I digress. I do think it’s extremely interesting and there certainly appear to be a series of coincidences there. I respect everyone’s opinion and interpretation very much, and Heather, your knowledge and discernment are profound and appreciated very much. But for me, I’m keeping an open mind and heart and i’m looking up! 🙂

    #129905
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    I get it, Dano. I’ll be the first to admit I do not have an open mind about those things. But each person should be comfortable with how they interpret things.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #129906

    Terry
    Participant

    Coincidentally there is a total solar eclipse in August (21st or 23rd I believe) that will present coast to coast darkness as its a total solar eclipse. And – Coincidentally to Terry’s post – an almost exact total solar eclipse will occur 7yrs later in October (15th I believe) 2024.

    Thanks Dan, for that information, and it’s interesting that there’s a total solar eclipse on October 15th 2024, but I believe Jesus will not return to this earth at that time, in the fall, but in the Spring.

    #129913
    Scipius
    Scipius
    Participant

    I know me posting on RITa is normally a death sentence for any thread or topic, but I’ll try again. While I don’t fully dismiss the Yom Teruah sign in the Heavens, I hold sincere doubts about it relating to the Rapture. I have always believed that Yom Teruah marks the beginning of the ministry of the two witnesses, if not their arrival.

    As for the sign in the heavens, I agree with Heather R that it is suspicious that we need software to even be aware of it. It’s not an obvious sign, neither is it one we were told to watch for it. We are told to watch for Jesus Christ, not anti christ, not conjunctions, stars and constellations, or anything else. When we see the sign, lift our heads high, our redemption drawers nigh.

    I have considered an alternate possibility that I haven’t found elsewhere. Satan is fully aware of the modem and the movement of stars. With him knowing the sign is ahead and his time is running short, wouldnt it be the perfect time to present his guy to the world? He is a master counterfeiter and I could see him trying to piggy back off of Gods Holiday. He uses the sign and the mode to give legitimacy to the advent of his “messiah”. If only there was a religious leader over a large body of believers who would authenticate such an imposter to attempt uniting the religions.

    Either way, if I’m right, the Antichrist may be drawing near. Which means we need to go. He should be be arriving to bring order out of chaos, which means war should be close. Any sign of that coming? I don’t really know, just some thoughts I have had. If I’m wrong, or if my post is offensive in anyway, please delete it. I only bring it up as a possibility. I could easily be wrong. What say ye?

    Romans 8:38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor heavenly rulers, nor things that are present, nor things to come, nor powers, 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in creation will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.



    #129915
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    lol @ threadkiller

    I’ll post again just so you don’t feel bad.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #129917

    2ndcoming
    Participant

    I am against these signs when we can find immense knowledge from scripture to point to the nearness of Jesus’ second coming. All these are man made signs by aligning stars to their own imagination. For people who live in China,Japan,Africa,Saudi,Israel,Europe,South America,,,,,they never heard of these signs nor have any knowledge or computer software to help them to figure out. These signs are only privilege to few. Is this how Jesus would want the world to know the nearness of his coming,by choosing few and ignore the rest of the world?

    We need to get back to scripture to figure out all the clues God has given us,instead of keep watching these man made signs through computer software.

    #129918
    Dano
    Dano
    Participant

    Lol. You two are funny! No thread killing. I think it’s great to actually just talk and lay perspectives on the table. It’s awesome. That’s the definition and purpose of debates and forums. We all get to learn a little and see things from someone else’s optics.
    Scipius- i do find your post a little bit confusing although I appreciate you trying to ground the conversation. However, the early part of your post says you don’t look look at the Yom Teruah signs as being a sign of the rapture, rather more likely a sign of the two witnesses. Umm- those are extremely closely related happenings, so- wouldn’t a sign of one being very indicative of the other?
    Also you said – and I very much agree- that we should be looking up and looking for Jesus Christ, not the anti christ, etc. Which I completely agree with but….then you go on to describe an “alternate” you have been considering and you show an interesting theory regarding how satan could use this as a way to present his guy. Which I think is a very plausible and interesting theory. But then….arent you the one looking for the ac in this instance, whereas the previous part of the thread was looking for the arrival of Jesus which is what you opened your post with? I’m sorry, I’m just a bit confused.
    And- as far as the necessity for software to see the “signs” in the heavens. Well- i might disagree with that one in some ways. I think if we lived 2500+ years ago and there were no distractions and technology, and no light pollution, we might spend an awful lot of time looking up and watching the stars and movements and patterns. I don’t actually know if software would be required. Maybe we’re the ones that need the software to understand what they saw. And how much divine inspiration was given to them as God could possibly use them or given them some wisdom to mark and describe future astronomical events . One could argue the incredibly accurate future information that the prophets received were so far beyond anything that any modern computer software prediction algorithms could ever provide. I’m just saying maybe.
    Heather – i think you’re awesome. Stubborn, in love in a great way but awesome. I learn so much from you. I think we all do, so I’m always grateful to read your input. I haven’t actually witnessed and patterned you as being a thread killer at all. I think you tend to open people’s minds and eyes which is a great blessing to us all. If ever you “end ” a thread, it’s likely because of the thought out, insightful research you point out and it could be like “boom ” ok- there’s the answer. Enough said let’s move on. Lol.
    And Terry- spring, fall, etc. I’m not challenging any position. I just thought the events and timing and biblical context one could apply to the events at hand are really cool, coincidental and the timing and number of days is very interesting. Who knows who’s right or wrong and honestly to me, it doesn’t matter. I just long to go home! The only thing I might suggest for all of us to remember – regardless of our opinions, research, etc. It is not for us to know the day or the hour or even try to predict it. But we should recognize the seasons the seasons we’re in and realize regardless of the time of year, our redemption grows very near. 🙂

    #129919

    Barry
    Participant

    I don’t know for certain if I put a lot of stock in any specific sign as it relates to the rapture. I believe there is no sign, it will just happen and we’ll open our eyes in Heaven. I read the 2024 sign bit over on Unsealed, but I didn’t really see it as anything significant.

    I don’t totally dismiss the Rev. 12 sign as insignificant, just because we might need software to view it. God knew we’d have software and would see something that at least somewhat resembles the text of Revelation 12. Given that so many different signs and events point to us nearing the end, dismissing Revelation 12 as being unrelated at all to the events leading up to the 2nd coming (as opposed to the rapture) seems short-sighted. Even if the Rev. 12 sign doesn’t portend the immediate beginning of the Tribulation, it could simply be a warning that it is at the door.

    I was watching a video of an interview with Carl Gallups today, and he mentioned that Carbon 12 has 6 protons, 6 neutrons and 6 electrons. 6,6,6. Does anyone think that’s a coincidence? I can’t see 6 protons either, and don’t fully understand exactly what it even means, but the fact that I’d have to use an electron microscope or read someone else’s research makes it no less true. Nor any less relevant.

    I suspect Satan cannot yet present his false christ because the Restrainer has not been withdrawn. Chuck Missler mentioned years ago that satan likely already has his man here, ready to go, because he has no idea when that time will come. But he still has to be ready to strike when it does.

    John 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? 68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

    #129920
    Dano
    Dano
    Participant

    Hi 2ndcoming. I agree scriptures are where the answers lay 100%. But scriptures do say very clearly that there will be signs in the heavens, the stars, moon and the sun. But most importantly is a point you made that whatever signs do come, they certainly would be for everyone in the world and not regional.

    #129921

    Barry
    Participant

    I am against these signs when we can find immense knowledge from scripture to point to the nearness of Jesus’ second coming. All these are man made signs by aligning stars to their own imagination. For people who live in China,Japan,Africa,Saudi,Israel,Europe,South America,,,,,they never heard of these signs nor have any knowledge or computer software to help them to figure out. These signs are only privilege to few. Is this how Jesus would want the world to know the nearness of his coming,by choosing few and ignore the rest of the world?
    We need to get back to scripture to figure out all the clues God has given us,instead of keep watching these man made signs through computer software.

    You may be correct on the significance, but I think it’s a stretch to call it a man-made sign.

    Half the planet has internet access now. Even 1/4 to 1/3rd of people in the 3rd world have internet.

    Further, the Bible gives us a significant # of specific events which will take place during/prior to the Tribulation. The importance or relevance of those signs isn’t dependent on the globe’s understanding of them. Take, for example, the Ezekiel 38 “War”. Someone in the heart of the Congo or down in the Amazon jungles may know nothing of Ezekiel 38, and still, after that event has happened, those same people may not know what has happened. Perhaps they’ll hear there was a big war, but maybe little beyond that. That some people are ignorant of Ezekiel 38 and the coming war makes it no less relevant.

    John 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? 68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

    #129937
    Tender Reed
    Tender Reed
    Participant

    The coming of the Son of Man is “likened” unto lightening in the sky seen by all from East to West, is a descriptive narration of it’s scope. Then we are told that the celestial lights will be dimmed. Then we are told the sign of the Son of Man will be seen. Then all shall see Him coming in the clouds in power and great glory.

    Much like the Rapture, it’s many events that are sequential in nature.

    But given the specific phraseology of the “Son of Man” as opposed to the Lord, or Son of God, etc, I am tempted to believe this sign to be a cross! For there is no other universal sign which speaks specifically to Christ, as like the cross.

    For then we are told even those that “pierced Him” shall see Him also.

    The cross is the central theme that the O.T. prepared us for. It is the emblem and standard of the N.T. which lifts Him and us. And being the linchpin of His redemption, justifies eternity in either Heaven or Hell!!!

    IMHO, any other sign or omen, regardless of it’s nature and origin, simply doesn’t match the power of the cross!!

    This is simply just a personal guess on my part.

    TR


    #129963
    TxThom
    TxThom
    Keymaster

    During this Age of Grace when most of His interactions with mankind are relatively subtle we grasp for anything we might call “a sign”. Like license plates, times on clocks, and arrangement of stars in certain software programs.

    A time is coming (soon) where God will once again interact with humanity in stunningly supernatural fashion. You know, the kind where everyone falls on their face in awe and fear of Him. When Jesus walked the earth the rabbinical histories tell us that the smoke of the offerings went straight up to heaven. Regardless of the wind. Stuff like that is a sign.

    But search out the OT for all the mentions of the sun and moon ceasing to give their light and you’ll quickly see that this isn’t the moon wandering in front of the sun, but God making a new beginning. An evening, then a light. A new day.

    No software needed.

    I am convinced of this, that the One who began a good action among you will bring it to completion by the Day of the Messiah Jesus. Philippians 1:6



    #129964

    Terry
    Participant

    Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

    Joel 3:15 The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

    You are correct, Heather, about what I thought was a 2024 Second Advent sign, which can’t be the sign of the Son of man in heaven, for the reasons you gave.

    I think what confused me is that the part about the stars withdrawing their shining wasn’t mentioned in Matthew 24:29, only the sun being darkened, the moon not giving it’s light, and the stars falling from heaven, but it’s mentioned in Joel 3:15. I don’t know why it’s not mentioned in Matthew 24:29. :scratch:
    Actually, I now realize that I totally misunderstood, at first.

    Plus, I think I really wanted to believe that sign that I mentioned in 2024 was the sign of the Son of man in heaven, because to me, it seemed like it really was the sign, but now I realize it can’t be!

    I know everyone really wants a sign to tell us how close we are.

    Aint that the truth!

    [quote quote=129937]The coming of the Son of Man is “likened” unto lightening in the sky seen by all from East to West, is a descriptive narration of it’s scope. Then we are told that the celestial lights will be dimmed. Then we are told the sign of the Son of Man will be seen. Then all shall see Him coming in the clouds in power and great glory.

    Your right, Tender Reed, thank you for that info, it was very helpful.

    I am glad I now know what this sign is, I appreciate both of your help, for helping me to realize what this sign is! 😉

    #129966
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    and the stars falling from heaven, but it’s mentioned in Joel 3:15. I don’t know why it’s not mentioned in Matthew 24:29.

    If you look at the original language re: the stars falling from heaven, that’s not a reference to actual stars. That’s more a reference to angelic host which are also referred to as stars.

    … and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.

    Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

    Joel 3 and Matthew 24 are referring to the same day, but the events they reference aren’t entirely similar.

    Regarding the stars falling from heaven & the powers of the heavens being shaken, also consider Daniel 7:

    Daniel 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. 10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #129974
    Scipius
    Scipius
    Participant

    Dano, let me be perfectly clear to avoid further confusion. At no time did I never not have any knowledge in regards to the allegedly unclear statements that I may have made in regards to watching for unspecified persons or events. There, I believe that clears everything up nicely.

    Sorry, I couldn’t help myself. Anyways. I did have to write my post hastily, I was trying to get it written right before starting work. In terms of watching for the Ac, I make no guesses of who he might be. The only reason I propose a possible timing for his assumption of power is that I do believe him taking power, the start of the 70th week and the start if the two witnesses ministries will all be concurrent events. If you would like concrete proof that they are concurrent, don’t ask me to provide it. It is what I have come to believe from my understanding of end times through study and contemplation. It is what I believe, not what I know.

    As for Harpazo, I still believe from our perspective it is imminent. Our Father in Heaven knows when He will send Yeshua. I believe but don’t know, that there is likely a gap betwixt our departure and Daniels 70th week. I do believe that out departure will be a rescue followed by sudden destruction. Chaos ensues, and one voice emerges to unite the people and rebuild. While the world is following the one voice, the people of Israel will be having their lost spiritual heritage restored to them. And the church will be resting, eternally secure.

    If I’m wrong, then so be it. I’m open to the possibility that I am wrong about everything. Even when I am wrong, God is always right. I shall however, continue watching and waiting for out blessed hope.

    Romans 8:38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor heavenly rulers, nor things that are present, nor things to come, nor powers, 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in creation will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.



    #130024

    Terry
    Participant

    If you look at the original language re: the stars falling from heaven, that’s not a reference to actual stars. That’s more a reference to angelic host which are also referred to as stars.

    Very interesting. I don’t think I ever thought of it like that. I guess the angelic host falling from heaven, are Satan’s angels being cast out of heaven. And I think Lucifer (Satan), still has access to heaven, so he can accuse the brethren day and night to God.
    But soon, Satan will be permanently cast out of heaven, and no longer have access to it. He will be bound to the earth. And when he is cast out of heaven (falls from heaven), his angels will be cast out of heaven with him, appearing as stars falling from heaven. I hope I got this right. Please correct me if I don’t.

    I guess Satan’s angels still have access to heaven, just as Satan does. I can understand why God would still allow Satan to have access to heaven, so he can be allowed to accuse the brethren, but I don’t understand why Satan’s angels would still have access to heaven. :unsure:

    #130036
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    I guess Satan’s angels still have access to heaven, just as Satan does. I can understand why God would still allow Satan to have access to heaven, so he can be allowed to accuse the brethren, but I don’t understand why Satan’s angels would still have access to heaven.

    There are three heavens:

    1.) The place where God dwells. – Third Heaven

    Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

    I think that’s probably a more specific reference to the Watcher angels who corrupted the earth before the flood. But then, you also have after the flood. What were they trying to do?

    Genesis 11:4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth. 5 And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded. 6 And the Lord said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

    The angels who fell do not have access to the third heaven, but they had been trying to use mankind to help them get it back. They had been attempting to reach into heaven and overthrow God. It did not work.

    In response to Satan being before the throne day and night – In Revelation 12, we are told the following:

    Revelation 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

    All that means is Satan’s actions are visible to God, not that he is actually standing in front of God’s throne.

    Hebrews 4:13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

    We also see that Satan is not before the throne of God, in Job.

    Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

    Job 2:2 And the Lord said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

    We actually see the exact same language about the two witnesses standing before the God of the earth.

    Revelation 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

    They certainly won’t be in the throne room. Their actions are simply visible to an omnipresent and omniscient God.

    2.) The celestial heavens – The Second Heaven

    The second and first heaven are currently Satan’s domain. He is referred to as the prince of the power of the air. Revelation 12, which describes events that will take place at the midpoint of the Week, also describes the war in heaven – the war in the celestial heavens. Notable about this war is that Michael is the antagonist. Satan is not. When it is time for Satan and his angels to be cut off from the second heaven, Michael and his angels will war against Satan. It is only then that Satan pulls his angels in to defend. However, there will be no defense for them. This is what is meant in Daniel 12:1 when we are told Michael shall stand up, and what will follow afterward is the “great tribulation”.

    Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, 8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. 10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

    This is the third woe and corresponds to the 7th Trumpet judgment.

    Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

    3.) The atmospheric heavens – The First Heaven

    Satan and his angels will be bound to the earth and its atmospheric heavens for the second part of Daniel’s 70th Week. His anger at having been permanently banned from the second heavens is part of why he is so full of wrath and goes to take it out on the Jews.

    Revelation 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. 14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. 15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. 16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth. 17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

    And the remnant of her seed which keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ? Those who did not flee will be killed.

    Revelation 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

    I’ll be starting writing much more about Rev 12 in the near future. However, with regard to the stars falling from heaven at the Second Coming, that’s more than likely talking about the angels who had access to the first heaven being brought down to earth and squashed like bugs by Jesus. Or, you know… something like that.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    #130041
    MyWhiteStone
    MyWhiteStone
    Participant

    Here’s a Candidate Tribulation Mid-Point: 6 Sivan 5777 (2 June 2017) plus 1,260 days comes to 13 November 2020. Interesting data point, ideally becoming a cast-in-stone kind covenant-breaking expectation in a couple short months from now. Just sayin’.

    I know that my Redeemer lives, and that in the end He will stand upon the earth. And after my skin has been destroyed, yet in my flesh I will see God; I myself will see Him with my own eyes -- I, and not another. How my heart yearns within me! Job19:25-27



    #130043
    Heather R
    Heather R
    Participant

    Well……. not that it means anything, but if those are the bookends of the Trib, the midpoint events would occur somewhere around mid-November. Like say 11/10 – 11/15ish.

    Revelation 11 is the midpoint of the Week, specifically those verses.

    Revelation 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth. 11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. 14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. 15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

    It probably doesn’t have any bearing on anything, but it’s interesting to me, nevertheless.

    Romans1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
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